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That is a interesting question… Maybe another good questions is how many people start out only fly fishing and end up mixing in or converting to conventional tackle?
Maybe another big factor is who's is attracted to each style of fishing. Now FlyGodess is a prime example. With a anyone can catch fish on lures or bait, but fly fishing takes true learning and detection BS attitude how welcoming is that to the new convert to fly fishing? Not very. How long would someone stick around that group of anglers?
Now considering that once apon a time I was the kid that had a junk fly fishing set up that my Dad had and never used. And on rough days when lures weren't working I'd bust it out and teach myself how to nymph. A few years later I weened myself of the conventional tackle and dove 100% fly tying and fishing. There I stayed for almost 15 years FLY ONLY.
The last 6 years I've dove into ice fishing (gasp yes and fishing bait) and absolutely love it. But the knowledge I've gained is indispensable and helps with ALL my angling. Also the last 3 years I've gone back to throwing gear and learning bass and bait caster etc since they are new and exciting.
The best part is that it makes me ALL a better angler. From throwing huge hard baits for tiger musky, jerk baits for trout, pounding hoppers out of a drift boat or tossing streamers on foot it's all different and appealing in different ways. But they all help you gather knowledge and that is true power in fishing.
At this point I can tell you the huge difference between fly fishing and the conventional tackle side of things. This is a true superiority complex from many fly anglers and that is the most unappealing thing about all the fishing styles and a reason I've separated from it more and more.
It's just fishing and nobody is better than anyone else because of the tackle they use… Well unless is a snagging rig or some garbage!
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I like to do both! I generally kick around on my tube dragging some kind of fly behind me, and toss jigs. I used to do nothing but fly fish rivers but the I got the stillwater bug in a bad way. I have hundreds of flies for the river that just sit in boxes. I think some people get turned off to fly fishing because of the elitist attitude that some fly fisherman have towards any other type of fishing. There is even dissension between the fly fishing community that nymphs and streamers are not really fly fishing. Just get out side and fish however you enjoy it best and screw what everyone else thinks. After all the days spent fishing cannot be deducted from a mans life.
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[quote NICH]
The last 6 years I've dove into ice fishing (gasp yes and fishing bait) and absolutely love it. But the knowledge I've gained is indispensable and helps with ALL my angling. Also the last 3 years I've gone back to throwing gear and learning bass and bait caster etc since they are new and exciting.
The best part is that it makes me ALL a better angler. From throwing huge hard baits for tiger musky, jerk baits for trout, pounding hoppers out of a drift boat or tossing streamers on foot it's all different and appealing in different ways. But they all help you gather knowledge and that is true power in fishing.
[/quote]
Word! +1, nicely written.
For me, in addition to helping me be a better angler, fishing with different gear and disciplines is just plain fun. For the first time in memory, this fall, I put the gear away and fished only with my fly equipment. Had a blast. Once ice fishing winds down, I'll probably do so again, until the bassin itch needs to be scratched. Or maybe something unpredictable right now. Its all fun. (I think you have more fun if one isn't worried about what others will think, right?).
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I use both. Thought I would never want to use a fly rod but then in the mid 90's I picked one up and now it is on my toon with my other gear. Last year I branched out and caught a few new species on the fly rod. Love it and won't leave it. Also love the other methods as well. So I will continue using all methods like I do now.
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[quote NICH]That is a interesting question… Maybe another good questions is how many people start out only fly fishing and end up mixing in or converting to conventional tackle?
Maybe another big factor is who's is attracted to each style of fishing. Now FlyGodess is a prime example. With a anyone can catch fish on lures or bait, but fly fishing takes true learning and detection BS attitude how welcoming is that to the new convert to fly fishing? Not very. How long would someone stick around that group of anglers?
I take it this the elitist label. I never said LURES I said bait. This is a proven fact that is why you will see 2 year olds using Bait. Lures are more like fly fishing actually. If this throws a wall in front of new coming Fly Fishers, then maybe this topic would have never come up and could save some people some money and frustration. Nothing I said was a lie, fabricated or BS, sorry. If this makes me a snob then so be it. I have never had a problem fishing with others no matter their choice. And I agree, life is not complete unless you try, so I encourage to TRY fly fishing, but with an open mind.
Now considering that once apon a time I was the kid that had a junk fly fishing set up that my Dad had and never used. And on rough days when lures weren't working I'd bust it out and teach myself how to nymph. A few years later I weened myself of the conventional tackle and dove 100% fly tying and fishing. There I stayed for almost 15 years FLY ONLY.
So you did have a learning curve and dedication?
The last 6 years I've dove into ice fishing (gasp yes and fishing bait) and absolutely love it. But the knowledge I've gained is indispensable and helps with ALL my angling. Also the last 3 years I've gone back to throwing gear and learning bass and bait caster etc since they are new and exciting.
The best part is that it makes me ALL a better angler. From throwing huge hard baits for tiger musky, jerk baits for trout, pounding hoppers out of a drift boat or tossing streamers on foot it's all different and appealing in different ways. But they all help you gather knowledge and that is true power in fishing.
At this point I can tell you the huge difference between fly fishing and the conventional tackle side of things. This is a true superiority complex from many fly anglers and that is the most unappealing thing about all the fishing styles and a reason I've separated from it more and more.
It's just fishing and nobody is better than anyone else because of the tackle they use… Well unless is a snagging rig or some garbage!
And this comment says it all but not what the O.P. was asking. So you still have your Fly Gear?.[/quote]
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Well said. Many techniques work and all are fun since the purpose is to catch fish right? I caught the fly fishing bug about 6 years ago and have spent thousands since. Now I build my own rods and tie my own flies but I also do not shun other methods. I own and use many other bait casting, spinning, and ice fishing gear and will use bait with no remorse if necessary. The smug, elitist, fly fishers actually make me sick, even though I love fly fishing.
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You guys got FG pegged all wrong, to be honest. I have fly fished for 25+ years, but in the two years or so that I've known and fished with her, my skill level and knowledge has grown by more than all the previous years combined. Don't make the mistake of mixing up passion with elitism. It's a fact, fly fishing isn't for everyone because it's a little more challenging, most fly flingers will catch less than their bait dunking buddies, and it is expensive. That's a losing combination when you're trying to recruit new people to the sport. That being said, if you've got the personality and the drive to learn all there is to know, and can become a master of it, then it's human nature to be proud of that fact. There are very few, and I mean VERY few, people who can claim that they are masters of the art, and I believe that those select-few people have the right to act however they want -- as long as they're not being complete tool-bags. (and of course, there will always be "that guy", I know.) It's part of the satisfaction of mastering something that nobody else really can or will, and like I said, it's human nature to be proud of your own accomplishments.
Instead of being offended by people you think are snobby, maybe call them on it and see if they can teach you a thing or two. Most of the masters that I've met and fished with have always been happy to help, and I've always been humbled by how much I didn't know that I was positive I did know.
Anyhow, sorry for the rant.
[size 6]O'Doyle Rules![/size]
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It was a damn good rant, TBD.
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See that wonderful attitude shining again?
You know me and you know my history with fly fishing and tying. You also know I have a insane amount (time and money) invested in fly tying specifically. I'm on several fly tying and fishing pro staffs (actually ones not just some friend or some startup companies) as well as a Rainy's Innovator with several patterns.
Here is a little story that sums it all up.
I spend a November day at Yuba in my boat throwing 7-9'' swim baits last year. It was a slow day but we ground it out all day anyway and get a few smaller fish. I pulled off at the end of the day with the only other boat really fishing (three guys fly fishing). They quickly struck up a conversation asking how we did etc from the other side of the lot. The small talk went something like this….
Fly Guys: How was fishing?
Me: It was rough today but got a few small ones and lost a nice one.
FG: Cool, just throwing gear?
Me: Yes. How'd you guys do?
FG. We got a couple strikes and a few follows.
Me: Yeah it was slow today I'm happy we got some action.
FG: Yeah It's a lot easier throwing gear for them. (I'd like to add I highly doubt he's thrown legit esox lures with heavy rods etc because anyone who has doesn't refer to it as EASY)
Me: Ha not for me. I'd do better fly fishing for them since the gear is new to me. What kinda flies were you guys fishing?
FG: Not sure you'd know what it is.
Me: Yeah try me I might surprise you…
FG: Yeah do you know what a El Chupacacra from Rainy's is?
ME: Absolutely… It's my pattern.
FG: Oh thats you. You're Nick.
Me: Yes thats me and walked over to shake hands.
I'd also like to add how they perked up and were munch more interested. I was no longer the guy on the other side of the fence "throwing gear" and taking the "easy" road to catching fish and they wanted to talk bs.
That sums up A LOT of fly anglers attitudes. I know I've lived it deeply I know. I also know how deep it runs in niches and subsets of fly fishing. You caught that steelhead on a egg/nymph it doesn't count. That brown was spawning so I doesn't count. You nymphet during a hatch are you stupid, oh and it doesn't count. Nice berry cutthroat, oh you caught it ice fishing when they are starving with bait so it doesn't count, it's all the same! It's ALL BS!
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No one, at all, called FG out. That's a misinterpretation to the max. I haven't been a member here that long but have already come to respect her as a fly fisher. The comment was made to the detriment of the "elitests" all over. No mention was made of her. Just to the smug, elitest fly fishers that are out there.
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I do know and respect you Nich. You have accomplished a lot.
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I'm not finished, actually...
Just to throw this out there, after 25+ years, I still fish almost exclusively with a fly rod, and that is usually 3 to 4 times a week, every week. I still use Wal-Mart style rod/reel combos, a mish-mash of random cheap reels that came pre-spooled with line, old dog fly rods that I find at garage sales and D.I., etc. The most I've ever paid for a rod was $450.00 for a Sage which lasted all of one trip before I took at back for a refund. (I went back to my mid-70's fiberglass Fenwick that I paid $5.00 for at a yard sale) My most expensive reel is a $50.00 Ross Reel that doesn't perform any better than my $25.00 Okuma reel, and isn't nearly as fun to use as my mid-60's Perrine automatic reel:
![[Image: Perrine_zpsf7fbc93d.jpg]](http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m71/flakestein/Perrine_zpsf7fbc93d.jpg)
To be honest, before meeting FlyGoddess, I had no idea what sinking line was, or that it had "x"'s to indicate how fast it would sink, etc. I just knew that my WF Floating line worked just fine,and if I needed it to sink, I'd add sinkers. I've purchased one sinking line in my life and it was devoured by WiperHunter's boat prop, so now I'm back to my WFF again -- works for me like a charm. I still don't know what the X's mean on tippit, I still don't know how to tie most of the knots that fly fishermen use, I still use giant indicators, I have a 5 weight line on my 3 weight rod, and frankly, my casting technique is embarrassingly bad. Who cares? I still catch fish, I still have fun, and I try not to let the intimidating stuff get to me. (I won the summer fly fishing contest too... </elitist>)
The point of all that was, do whatever feels right to you, and don't get bogged down by all of the intricacies of fly fishing. The idea is to have fun, not stress out and be frustrated. All that detailed crap will come with time, maybe, if you want it to. Buy a cheap set up and go hit the river; there is no better teacher than trial and error, imo, and few things more satisfying than catching that first fish on a fly.
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I'm really not attacking you, just pointing out what may deter someone from fly fishing long term. And I think other than, learning curve and cost (which I agree with 100%) the other major factor is a perceived snobby or elitist attitude that fly fishing is KNOW for. I know I used to be one of them!
Fly fishing trout on a small stream is one of the easiest forms of angling I can think of. You can get a way with minimal gear and the fish are plentiful and eager and hungry.
Fishing large gear for musky/pike is one of the hardest I've done. It's physically taxing (the same or more than fly fishing for them), has a HUGE learning curve of tactics, gear and finding fish. Then getting them to eat is way more challenging. Not to mention the gear and lures are just as $$$ as any fly stuff I own. Not many flies being sold for on average of $20-$50.
Then you have a middle ground of sorts like with strawberry. Someone trolling a lure is pretty on par as far as difficulty as someone fly fishing in a pontoon with a motor. You both essential trolling under power. I don't see anyone having the edge in that one.
So it's WAY more situational than what style of fishing you are doing. It has a lot to do with what your fishing for and how you approaching it.
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Truer words have never been spoken
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[quote Fin_Addict]No one, at all, called FG out. That's a misinterpretation to the max. I haven't been a member here that long but have already come to respect her as a fly fisher. The comment was made to the detriment of the "elitests" all over. No mention was made of her. Just to the smug, elitest fly fishers that are out there.[/quote]
Well, ya, good point. Except for that one little thingy...
Quote:Maybe another big factor is who's is attracted to each style of fishing. Now FlyGodess is a prime example. With a anyone can catch fish on lures or bait, but fly fishing takes true learning and detection BS attitude how welcoming is that to the new convert to fly fishing? Not very. How long would someone stick around that group of anglers?
I know you're new here and you're just full of uneducated opinions, but seriously, did you bother to read the thread?
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Was trying pay you and FG a compliment but it seems you ###### are incapable of taking one. You people are some of the most ungrateful I've ever met in my life. This state has got to rank in top as one of the worst I've ever lived in. Only been here about a half a year but already looking forward to leaving. #2 on worst places ever lived. Good riddance to this waste of space called "Utah"
Note from a mod:
Not sure why this was left unedited. Be warned, you are new here. Go read the rules, and take a step back.
And to ANYONE who uses "retard" as an insult, expect a ban. Zero tolerance. Enuf.
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Hahaha, nice.
Don't let the door... well, you know the rest.
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Trust me, I won't and I'll never look back. Never met people as lacking as I have in this state and I've been a lot of places. You people have a lot to learn. This state is good for absolutely nothing and you can ask anyone form outside this POS that.
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[quote TroutBumDave][quote Fin_Addict]No one, at all, called FG out. That's a misinterpretation to the max. I haven't been a member here that long but have already come to respect her as a fly fisher. The comment was made to the detriment of the "elitests" all over. No mention was made of her. Just to the smug, elitest fly fishers that are out there.[/quote]
Well, ya, good point. Except for that one little thingy...
Quote:Maybe another big factor is who's is attracted to each style of fishing. Now FlyGodess is a prime example. With a anyone can catch fish on lures or bait, but fly fishing takes true learning and detection BS attitude how welcoming is that to the new convert to fly fishing? Not very. How long would someone stick around that group of anglers?
I know you're new here and you're just full of uneducated opinions, but seriously, did you bother to read the thread?[/quote]
Obviously you feel the need to defend her for some reason. I guess that reason was quoting her saying that anyone can catch fish with bait. I can think I a mired of situation where that is not true but I'll save you my "uneducated opinions".
If you knew anything about me you'd consider calling this life long passionate angler "uneducated". You can call me a lot of things like "stubborn and opinionated" and sometimes "rude and blunt" but considering you've fly fished for so long and didn't even "know what a sinking line is" maybe you need to reconsider you own mud slinging bud!?!
And yes I read the thread. I am though, wondering how your reading comprehension is?
There again another cheery open armed fly fisher TroutBumDave. I bet there are converts waiting to fish with you.
P.S. I don't know that Utah hater guy [shocked]
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[quote flygoddess]Rivers don't ice up. I have been fishing just about every day. [  ][/quote]
They do up here in Cache [frown] I'm pretty excited about the warm weather in the forecast though and hope to finally get out soon.
As for the question at hand. I left the bait behind when I was a kid (except for the occasional catfish trip) and then moved on to lures for mostly warm water species. When I moved to Utah, I took up fly fishing, and for several years, I was exclusive with it. About six years ago, I moved to Cache Valley and got heavily into bass fishing again. While I really like catching them on the fly, I got back into lure fishing with a vengeance. I learned to use baitcasting gear and make my own soft plastics. I still pretty much fish flies exclusively for trout, and bring them out for the other species a bit as well. I kind of neglected the long rod last year, but I have a bunch of poppers and articulated sculpins I plan on flinging this year.
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